Rangerland Forum Information

[rightbug]

On education I'd say he is to the right of Bush.

From a policy perspective, Obama is pretty much a Republican circa 1993:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/eco...ry.html?hpid=z3

It's only because the window has shifted so far to the right now that he is considered a centrist. Trying to paint him as a leftist, let alone a socialist is hilarious.

[ThunderDawg]

Mitt Romney is the only credible candidate to Obama's shoe-in re-election campaign. He might have won against Obama in 2008, or at least given him a real challenge. And, as usual, it will be a Dem's race to lose. But I don't see Barry fucking up along the lines of Dumbya or Slick Willy. I know way too many Reds who were put off by McCain. In fact, I know a lot of conservatives from Massachusetts who had never voted Democrat until Obama. But mainstream Republicans, the 'core' or 'base' or whatever you want to call it, will not let him win the nomination. I guess it's not his turn. If they don't get a serious candidate, really fucking soon, they might as well concede the race in a couple weeks.

Four and a half years ago, nine candidates jumped into the Democratic field the minute the midterm elections ended. They didn't even fucking wait until after Christmas. Because we were coming off the Worst President in Modern History. A Goddamned, Fucking Retard. We are now fully seven and a half months past that same time frame, and sad to see it but the Repugs have already given up. I would bet not only the ranch but both of my testicles on Barack.

[Hockey101]

Could you specify this data then? Also on the whole redistribution of wealth the GOP does it too. Just because you behave like a dyslexic Robin Hood does not mean you aren't redistributing wealth.

I guess this is an indicator.

I wouldn't consider this as hard data because such a survey is very hard to conduct, the margin of error should be fairly high, and it is such a general....nationwide poll. It's not as specific as other polls. But, it is consistent with previous polls. So, the general idea is that about 20% of Americans consider themselves as liberals. Let's say it could be 30%, though. Even if so..., then liberal policies may not be supported by 70%.

And i already said we have redistribution of wealth in this country (regardless of political parties). Our taxes are used to fund certain programs. This is why we are a mixed economy, and not fully emerged into capitalism. I find that fair. What i do not like, however, is an increased interest in redistribution of wealth from the leaders of our government.

[Fuzz]

Is this where i can make fun of Schwarzenegger for knocking up a cleaning lady?

"No.. No.. Ok, mr. Arnold."

[Hockey101]

E,

He is a Socialist but he wont run as a Socialist because the Constitution wont allow it? He is a Socialist but the banks have too much power to allow him to be? He is in the pockets of big business but he is a Socialist?

All i said was that the guy is a believer in socialism, but there are factors that hold him back from taking actions to pass socialist-like policies. I think the best example was his original universal healthcare plan. A few years ago Obama admitted that he is a believer in a single-payer healthcare program. In other words, no private insurance companies, but a single...government insurance plan. That is socialism. That is a part of the socialist philosophy; to have government control sectors to the fullest.

Now...what stopped Obama from doing what he believes in? For one, a single payer government plan means eliminating the private sector altogether, which also means putting a dent into our economy. Two, he did not have full support of his own party to do as such because it is not what they believed in and they saw that such a system would not fit in this country. And three, the risk of losing campaign funds and disassociations. If these three factors were not a problem for Obama, he would have acted on this socialist plan.

And if he had no agenda then why the hell would he become President if he couldn't deliver on anything that he believed in?

He did have an agenda, but because it's politics that he hasn't delivered. Do you think Obama wanted the Bush tax cuts? No. The guy made his arguments against it very clearly. Next thing you know, he extended them. Why? You are the president, the chief of the country. He did not want the Bush tax cuts extended. He did it anyway. Why? Because he didn't have the balls not to? Because he was told to extend them by interest groups? Or, because he had to because of the state of the economy? I think it's the fact that the state of the economy did not allow him to do it. He was advised by his own people to proceed with the extension. If he didn't and stood by his philosophy, then our current economy right now could possibly be worse, including the stock market.

I believe, in my opinion, that this country cannot work with such philosophies that Obama believes in.

I think you are over analyzing what i said.

[Charlie]

He did have an agenda, but because it's politics that he hasn't delivered. Do you think Obama wanted the Bush tax cuts? No. The guy made his arguments against it very clearly. Next thing you know, he extended them. Why? You are the president, the chief of the country. He did not want the Bush tax cuts extended. He did it anyway. Why? Because he didn't have the balls not to? Because he was told to extend them by interest groups? Or, because he had to because of the state of the economy? I think it's the fact that the state of the economy did not allow him to do it. He was advised by his own people to proceed with the extension. If he didn't and stood by his philosophy, then our current economy right now could possibly be worse, including the stock market.

I believe, in my opinion, that this country cannot work with such philosophies that Obama believes in.

I think you are over analyzing what i said.

Wait, what? Did you pay attention at all to the news when the issue with the Bush tax cuts came about? He extended them as part of a quid pro quo. He wanted unemployment benefits extended. The only way the GOP was going to let that happen was extending the Bush tax cuts. He wanted nothing to do with them, but it was a political necessity. The economy had nothing to do with it, unless you meant unemployment benefits.

[Hockey101]

Wait, what? Did you pay attention at all to the news when the issue with the Bush tax cuts came about? He extended them as part of a quid pro quo. He wanted unemployment benefits extended. The only way the GOP was going to let that happen was extending the Bush tax cuts. He wanted nothing to do with them, but it was a political necessity. The economy had nothing to do with it, unless you meant unemployment benefits.

So you're saying that he lost? I remember the situation. It was a "deal", but he still passed something that he did not want and argued heavily against.

[Charlie]

So you're saying that he lost? I remember the situation. It was a "deal", but he still passed something that he did not want and argued heavily against.

I absolutely think he lost.

Edit: Let me clarify that. I'm not sure if he could have gotten anything better, with the GOP so firmly for the tax cuts. I just think extending the unemployment benefits was not as big a win as the tax cuts was a lose.

This post has been edited by Charlie: May 17 2011, 04:13 PM

[Hockey101]

I absolutely think he lost.

Edit: Let me clarify that. I'm not sure if he could have gotten anything better, with the GOP so firmly for the tax cuts. I just think extending the unemployment benefits was not as big a win as the tax cuts was a lose.

And if i were a liberal id be pissed off. Obama had high approval, the senate, and the house. Why didnt he repeal the Bush tax cuts and make his own plan then? He had two years to do it and now got to the point where he is handcuffed. Wherenis the leadership in that? What did the guy do for this long? Argue on healthcare only to get a crappy watered down version of it? The guy campaigned on giving tax cuts to 95%. What does he have to show for it? Bush's name.

This is the kimd of change Obama has to show for? Id be pissed.

Anyway... Im done talking Oba,a for now. Back to Gop!

[Charlie]

Anyway... Im done talking Oba,a for now. Back to Gop!

So... Tim Pawlenty looking good. And by him, I mean his wife.



This post has been edited by Charlie: May 17 2011, 07:23 PM

[Hockey101]

So... Tim Pawlenty looking good. And by him, I mean his wife.

Doesn't beat Kucinich, but damnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.....

[Nilan 666]

Also with Kucinich you get the reverse where the wife towers over him.

[Hockey101]

Also with Kucinich you get the reverse where the wife towers over him.

It would make me feel too uncomfortable dating a taller girl than my height.

But yeah, not like Kucinich is Napoeleon either...

[Nilan 666]

I'd get over it in a hurry.

[LisaLisa]

Santorum is done. No way he'll be able to explain this one away.


Santorum: McCain Doesn't Understand Interrogation

[bloodorange]

Pfft, Santorum never had a chance anyway. What an ass.

[Hockey101]

I don't think it's as big a deal that it would totally finish his chances, but it does put a dent for sure.

[ThunderDawg]

Santorum is essentially saying that we already knew where ObL was (even though the former senator has been a private citizen for five years without any national security clearance vs. McCain). So he just needs to answer one question: If we did get that information from waterboarding Khalid Sheik Mohammad, why was Osama bin Laden still alive when Obama was sworn in?

This post has been edited by ThunderDawg: May 18 2011, 10:18 AM

[Charlie]

Santorum is essentially saying that we already knew where ObL was (even though the former senator has been a private citizen for five years without any national security clearance vs. McCain). So he just needs to answer one question: If we did get that information from waterboarding Khalid Sheik Mohammad, why was Osama bin Laden still alive when Obama was sworn in?

Biding our time.

[Nilan 666]

He is a frothy mix of crazy and stupid.

[Beamer]

So... Tim Pawlenty looking good. And by him, I mean his wife.

Daughter, or a very good picture. His wife is 50. That looks like someone in their early 20s.

[Ebase]

I don't think it's as big a deal that it would totally finish his chances, but it does put a dent for sure.

Gonna be real hard to pivot off of that brain fart.

This may shock you but I am going to defend John McCain vehemently here.

First thing is, as a politician I used to respect McCain. Against Bush he ran a campaign that was his own. He was a moderate centrist and had the ability to cross lines. He lost, and when he won the nomination he moved right to appease the lunatics on the right. If there is one thing about McCain that I always liked, it was his stance on torture. And no one in politics should dare question his credentials until they have been thru the levels of enhanced interrogation that he has.

I interpret this as an assault on a genuine American hero. He may have been the opposition during the election but to me his wartime credentials are above reproach.

The problem here 101 is that you are right, it does put a dent but that is about it. The right wing loves torture because I believe psychologically they are getting even with a fundamentalist who hates America. If you ever have studied anything about societies and mass murder you understand that the first step to genocide is to begin to see your opposition as less then human. Therefore, empathy disappears. This is what always concerns me about the casual way people talk about "enhanced interrogation."

Its a dent because the Bush campaign in 1999 painted McCain as a crazy punch-drunk lunatic for his moderate views and even used 501's to paint McCain as in some way unfit to serve because of what he had been through. I found this utterly disgusting.

Not to derail but I know that a post 911 McCain would have handled things far differently then President Bush did.

Santorum should immediately and publicly apologize to McCain but I agree ultimately the right is so ADHD and their hatred so deep for what they see as the ni*ger in the White House that if Santorum is the man, then he will be their man, McCain be damned...

[The Fast Choker]

Daughter, or a very good picture. His wife is 50. That looks like someone in their early 20s.

Definitely not the wife. he's got 2 daughters, so it could be one of them.

[bloodorange]

Definitely not the wife. he's got 2 daughters, so it could be one of them.

Yeah, I was gonna say. His wife is good-looking but that is simply not a 50-year-old's body. Even a hot one's.

[Charlie]

Definitely not the wife. he's got 2 daughters, so it could be one of them.

Yeah, it looks like his daughter.

As for Santorum, I can't think of the last time I face palmed so hard. What's so ironic about it is that it's Santorum that has literally no idea what he is talking about. Ignoring the obvious, McCain was tortured for almost six years, McCain is one of the top members of the Armed Forces Committee. Santorum never held a foreign affairs position while in the Senate.

His statements come entirely from "what he has heard." He is talking out of his ass, and then proceeds to say something insanely stupid about McCain.

A brainfart of epic proportions. But, 101 is right. It won't make too big a difference in the long run.

[Hockey101]

Gonna be real hard to pivot off of that brain fart.

This may shock you but I am going to defend John McCain vehemently here.

First thing is, as a politician I used to respect McCain. Against Bush he ran a campaign that was his own. He was a moderate centrist and had the ability to cross lines. He lost, and when he won the nomination he moved right to appease the lunatics on the right. If there is one thing about McCain that I always liked, it was his stance on torture. And no one in politics should dare question his credentials until they have been thru the levels of enhanced interrogation that he has.

I interpret this as an assault on a genuine American hero. He may have been the opposition during the election but to me his wartime credentials are above reproach.

The problem here 101 is that you are right, it does put a dent but that is about it. The right wing loves torture because I believe psychologically they are getting even with a fundamentalist who hates America. If you ever have studied anything about societies and mass murder you understand that the first step to genocide is to begin to see your opposition as less then human. Therefore, empathy disappears. This is what always concerns me about the casual way people talk about "enhanced interrogation."

Its a dent because the Bush campaign in 1999 painted McCain as a crazy punch-drunk lunatic for his moderate views and even used 501's to paint McCain as in some way unfit to serve because of what he had been through. I found this utterly disgusting.

Not to derail but I know that a post 911 McCain would have handled things far differently then President Bush did.

Santorum should immediately and publicly apologize to McCain but I agree ultimately the right is so ADHD and their hatred so deep for what they see as the ni*ger in the White House that if Santorum is the man, then he will be their man, McCain be damned...

I like McCain in a sense that i respect him, but he is not a favorite politician of mine. Not sure how anyone can like a veteran pol like himself who pretty much said "i know how to get Bin Laden, so vote for me". If he knew how to, it was his duty to tell us. The guy is an independent leaning to the right. He talks like a centrist to independents and moderate democrats, but with the conservative base he put himself as this "hey, i am as conservative as Bush was!". Well.........which is it? You can't be both.

Now, i am in favor of torture. If i have to break a man's leg, arm, jaw, nose, and rip off his testies so he tells me where a bomb is that could blow up hundreds of people. I am all for it. If a thug on the streets would ever kidnap a family member of mine and not tell me where he/she was unless i would tear him up, then i am for it. Wouldn't you be?

Is it pretty? No. Do i like it? No. This idea that most conservatives are in favor of torture because they take a liking to it is ridiculous. Sure some fanatics, but who doesn't have fanatics? I don't like torture, but i am in favor of it if it helps us saves lives or catch bad guys that are ready to turn lives into deaths.

If McCain beat Bush and i presume Gore, then i don't know. It would be different, but you can't say for better or worse. Your personal opinion is one thing and i respect it despite disagreeing with it. My thought is, things happen for a reason. Obama happened for a reason and if people tell me "too bad McCain did not win, things would have been better" i say no. You can't know. McCain could have done worse than Obama, and i believe he could have.

And please...don't generalize the right by talking about their hatred for the ni... in the WH. That's taking it too far and you are ridiculously generalizing. Let's not go into these arguments and ruin a very well discussed thread.

[Ebase]

Now, i am in favor of torture. If i have to break a man's leg, arm, jaw, nose, and rip off his testies so he tells me where a bomb is that could blow up hundreds of people. I am all for it. If a thug on the streets would ever kidnap a family member of mine and not tell me where he/she was unless i would tear him up, then i am for it. Wouldn't you be?

Is it pretty? No. Do i like it? No. This idea that most conservatives are in favor of torture because they take a liking to it is ridiculous. Sure some fanatics, but who doesn't have fanatics? I don't like torture, but i am in favor of it if it helps us saves lives or catch bad guys that are ready to turn lives into deaths.

Do you understand the nature of torture, waterboarding, or the like?

Why don't you ask the Israeli's about it. They are the masters of getting information from enemies and they have not used torture for over 10-years. They understand that people will say anything in order to not be tortured any longer. Look at McCain. In his own book he writes how he bore shame because he denounced his own country. They broke him. He would say anything to get them to stop. Is that an effective means of extrapolating useful information? Torture a guy until he will say anything he thinks you want to hear in order to get you to stop?

I call BS. I think that most of the pro-tortuers fall into two primary threads when it comes to torture:

1. They actually think that it works. They believe that it has obtained myriads of actionable intelligence that stopped terrorism from occurring. Yet the credible corner's of government has released only vague references to its success. And the international intelligence community has scoffed at the notion.

2. They see it as revenge or treating them like the piece of shit they are. They see them as the enemy they are and so fuck 'em if they get tortured. They feel gratified that the asshole is getting all he deserves.

The truth is despite the potential of the fierce urgency of now scenarios torture has almost no effect. Know thy enemy!!! Who do you think you are dealing with? You think these guys will just have their will broken? They willfully take on the best that the American military has to offer without flinching. They have no fear of death in the process. They would put a suicide belt on their waist and blow it up in a crowd with tears of glee at martyrdom.

FBI, CIA standards and practices studies have clearly shown that torture has serious limitations in gaining accurate information. It is useless to extract intelligence from a person who is in so much pain that they will tell you anything in order to make it stop. Its a fact.

I suggest you read George Piro. He was the interrogator of Saddam Hussein who within 30-days had Saddam spilling information like a sib.

Santorum is a tool for his suggestions. Santorum should be ashamed of himself to make the assertion in support of torture over McCain's security clearance and knowledge of the situation. Santorum should be ashamed that he took a true American hero who had been subjected to the most brutal and ruthless torture available and decreed that McCain doesn't know what he is talking about. Ask John McCain who had his feet and hands beaten with hammers. Who had his collar bones broken and his shoulders cracked to the point he can no longer lift his arms. A man who has been tied to a post while ants bit him in the hot sun. A man thrown in a pit with piss and shit thrown all over him. McCain's story is so brutal it brings tears to the eyes.

Santorum was playing to a base who thinks like you do. And it is disgusting and far beneath what this country should be. Do you know several when I am talking casually with colleagues and clients outside the US Guantanamo comes up? Other countries in the 1st world think that we lost our God-damn minds. My wife's family in Manila has commented that we are so wrong for doing this. Thats the 3rd world we are talking about. And they don't even have the death penalty there. Maybe it is because they are Catholics and believe in the gospels. And some of these are not people who live in places immune to Al Qaeda's attacks.

Santorum can kiss off as far as I am concerned and so can anyone else who thinks this way. They are beneath me. And frankly, any Christian in all of its denominations that supports torture has violated its confessed allegiance to Christ and can no longer be considered part of his true church. I would call on you and any other follower of Christ to decree status confessionis. Or you better hope that God doesn't exist because you are so fucked.

[Nilan 666]

I'm still trying to figure out how the government that can't be trusted with health insurance can be trusted to torture people.

[Charlie]

Letter from Leon Panetta to John McCain.

Nearly 10 years of intensive intelligence work led the CIA to conclude that Bin Ladin was likely hiding at the compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan. there was no one “essential and indispensible” key piece of information that led us to this conclusion. Rather, the intelligence picture was developed via painstaking collection and analysis. Multiple streams of intelligence — including from detainees, but also from multiple other sources — led CIA analysts to conclude that Bin Ladin was at this compound. Some of the detainees who provided useful information about the facilitator/courier’s role had been subjected to enhanced interrogation techniques. Whether those techniques were the “only timely and effective way” to obtain such information is a matter of debate and cannot be established definitively. What is definitive is that that information was only a part of multiple streams of intelligence that led us to Bin Ladin.

Let me further point out that we first learned about the facilitator/courier’s nom de guerre from a detainee not in CIA custody in 2002. It is also important to note that some detainees who were subjected to enhanced interrogation techniques attempted to provide false or misleading information about the facilitator/courier. These attempts to falsify the facilitator/courier’s role were alerting.

In the end, no detainee in CIA custody revealed the facilitator/courier’s full true name or specific whereabouts. This information was discovered through other intelligence means.

There is no concrete evidence that torture led to getting Bin Laden. It may have, but if it did there is no evidence that that said information could not have been achieved without torture.

Also, the term "enhanced interrogation techniques" is infuriating. What a bullshit attempt to put lipstick on a pig. It is torture. Call it what it really is.

[LisaLisa]

I call BS. I think that most of the pro-tortuers fall into two primary threads when it comes to torture:

1. They actually think that it works. They believe that it has obtained myriads of actionable intelligence that stopped terrorism from occurring. Yet the credible corner's of government has released only vague references to its success. And the international intelligence community has scoffed at the notion.

A lot of those who support torture have never been in the service, and they think Jack Bauer is a hero. Don't tell them that Jack Bauer isn't real. They won't believe it.

Santorum is a tool for his suggestions. Santorum should be ashamed of himself to make the assertion in support of torture over McCain's security clearance and knowledge of the situation. Santorum should be ashamed that he took a true American hero who had been subjected to the most brutal and ruthless torture available and decreed that McCain doesn't know what he is talking about. Ask John McCain who had his feet and hands beaten with hammers. Who had his collar bones broken and his shoulders cracked to the point he can no longer lift his arms. A man who has been tied to a post while ants bit him in the hot sun. A man thrown in a pit with piss and shit thrown all over him. McCain's story is so brutal it brings tears to the eyes.

Santorum was playing to a base who thinks like you do. And it is disgusting and far beneath what this country should be. Do you know several when I am talking casually with colleagues and clients outside the US Guantanamo comes up? Other countries in the 1st world think that we lost our God-damn minds. My wife's family in Manila has commented that we are so wrong for doing this. Thats the 3rd world we are talking about. And they don't even have the death penalty there. Maybe it is because they are Catholics and believe in the gospels. And some of these are not people who live in places immune to Al Qaeda's attacks.

Santorum can kiss off as far as I am concerned and so can anyone else who thinks this way. They are beneath me. And frankly, any Christian in all of its denominations that supports torture has violated its confessed allegiance to Christ and can no longer be considered part of his true church. I would call on you and any other follower of Christ to decree status confessionis. Or you better hope that God doesn't exist because you are so fucked.

But here's the thing--Santorum knows he won't be punished by other republicans. Dubya did the same thing to McCain. In fact, he did worse. I was disgusted by the way he treated McCain, and I wasn't a McCain supporter, but I respected him. And what was Bush's punishment? He was made the republican nominee. In the larger scheme, his words are reprehensible. Within the republican stronghold? They don't care. Where are the denoucements of Santorum? Where's his apology to McCain? Where's the backlash from the republicans? Nowhere. If he were a democrat and attacked McCain like that, he would've been thrown under the bus immediately.

[Beamer]

I'm still trying to figure out how the government that can't be trusted with health insurance can be trusted to torture people.

Not picking a side here, just saying I don't see a connection.



Absolutely zero overlap in skillsets.

[EarlyCuyler]

Hi everyone. I enjoyed reading this thread tremendously. And here I thought yous were all just hockey hooligans. I have nothing to add about the republican field. But I think both parties are completely fucked. They have both raped this country, you can pick instances where each have come down on the wrong side of an issue. The bigger issue is that politics in this country are BROKEN beyond repair. Broken by money, and corporate domination of the media.

[Beamer]

Hi everyone. I enjoyed reading this thread tremendously. And here I thought yous were all just hockey hooligans. I have nothing to add about the republican field. But I think both parties are completely fucked. They have both raped this country, you can pick instances where each have come down on the wrong side of an issue. The bigger issue is that politics in this country are BROKEN beyond repair. Broken by money, and corporate domination of the media.

Don't think you need the word "corporate" there, but yeah, politics are about winning and losing rather than helping the country.

[Nilan 666]

Not picking a side here, just saying I don't see a connection.
Absolutely zero overlap in skillsets.

More of an attack on the idea that our government is too big and powerful yet it can be trusted to torture people. Basically the duality is that they are economic anarchists but seem to want a police state.

[rightbug]

A dramatic rendering of the statement released by Gingrich's press secretary yesterday. (Not, this is the actual statement, verbatim. Hilarious.)

[Kusand]

That's a wonderful piece. Nice.

[LisaLisa]

Can any mod find and embed the John Lithgow's reading of Gingrich's statement from last night's Colbert show? It was hilarious. Please?

[Hockey101]

Newt has drawn bad attention to himself. Some pundits think it will help him, but i disagree.

I am really sick of DC politics. The politicians in DC have too much self interests, conflict of interests, and have no idea how to lead this country. My opinion prior to the 2008 run, with the nominations still ongoing, was that i did not want a politician connected with DC. I don't like senators becoming presidents. I prefer governors. Newt was the speaker of the house......couldn't be more connected than that. What has the guy really done for so many years? Nothing.

I just wish some of these guys would stay out. It's as if they want to be popular, remain popular, and want the media attention. Their egos are ridiculous.

Newt, do everyone a favor. Go back to writing books. Just watch out for the glitter attacks.

[Hockey101]

I just received an e-mail from the Romney campaign that he will be in Boca in June. To enter it's $1,000, and to sponsor and getting a picture taken with him it's $5,000.

So... anybody have change? Change?

[Hockey101]

According to the Post, Obama set out "his people" to dig up dirt on Chris Christie, who said about a zillion times he won't run.

Mitch Daniels, thought to join the race a little later, confirmed he will not.

Pawlenty confirmed he is running, as well as Herman Cain.

[Rocha]

Minnesota Palin... er, excuse me, Michelle Bachmann, announced today she's running for prez. Hilarious!

[Hockey101]

That was expected, but so far the polls have her way down. I wonder if this means that Palin will not run at 100%. There were some rumors that her recent visit to Iowa...or NH was it, indicated that she was going to run.

Rick Perry may also get in.

[ThunderDawg]

[rightbug]

Sarah Palin is giving the good people of Boston some history lessons:

Palin described Paul Revere “sending those warning shots and bells” to tell Americans that “the British weren’t taking away our arms.”

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/watch-cnn-ancho...-midnight-ride/

[Hockey101]

This lady could have been so powerful is she studied more and made her speeches look more presentable. That being said, i still like her as a person, and i think she would do well as governor for a small state. But on a national level she doesn't have the.....how can i put it.... street smarts. I think she should have gone on the "i need to be well coached by experienced politicians" road and not the "i'll do it my way because i have a fan base that believes in me" road.

In the end, the GOP will battle within for the time being until a nominee is elected. But once that nominee is elected it will unite and every base, from moderate Republican, to established Republican, to conservative Republican, and tea party Republicans, will act on an anti-Obama vote.

Romney put forth a good speech yesterday, i was pleased.

[rightbug]

...i think she would do well as governor for a small state.

This is demonstrably untrue.

Meanwhile, it looks like Bachman is actually going to run! Hilarious.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/06...tion+Central%29

[ThunderDawg]

That being said ... i think she would do well as governor for a small state.

She was a Half Term Governor in a state with a smaller population than the county you live in.

All of your County Commissioners are more qualified to be President than Sarah.

[Hockey101]

This is demonstrably untrue.

Meanwhile, it looks like Bachman is actually going to run! Hilarious.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/06...tion+Central%29

Alaska did fairly well with her, so not sure what you are talking about there.

[Hockey101]

She was a Half Term Governor in a state with a smaller population than the county you live in.

All of your County Commissioners are more qualified to be President than Sarah.

I understand your point. But, she still did a good job making the right decisions, mostly, for that state as governor. You can't deny that. If she goes back to governing Alaska, i think she would do fine.

[Ebase]

This lady could have been so powerful is she studied more and made her speeches look more presentable. That being said, i still like her as a person, and i think she would do well as governor for a small state. But on a national level she doesn't have the.....how can i put it.... street smarts. I think she should have gone on the "i need to be well coached by experienced politicians" road and not the "i'll do it my way because i have a fan base that believes in me" road.

In the end, the GOP will battle within for the time being until a nominee is elected. But once that nominee is elected it will unite and every base, from moderate Republican, to established Republican, to conservative Republican, and tea party Republicans, will act on an anti-Obama vote.

Romney put forth a good speech yesterday, i was pleased.

I tell you this:

The GOP is not assembling an impressive array to take on Obama. Right now, somewhere in the bowels of the Democratic Election machine is a bunch of people asking themselves, "seriously?"

Right now, and mind you I have a pretty inaccurate crystal ball, it looks to me a little like when Bob Dole became the GOP nominee. And he was faced off against Bill Clinton. We shall see, but as of right now the group that the GOP is preparing to field are all pretty weak candidates.

I understand your point. But, she still did a good job making the right decisions, mostly, for that state as governor. You can't deny that. If she goes back to governing Alaska, i think she would do fine.

myth... What did she do that was so mind-shattering for Alaska? She put the State jet on E-Bay? Come on now. Palin has reached a mythic status where she swung down from the heavens and swung her hammer of justice and fixed the state with the lowest population and the most revenue from natural resources. I have read of all of her so called, "achievements" and almost none of them were earth shattering nor anything special. But she sure does a lot of chest thumping over that 2-years of game changing.



This post has been edited by Ebase: Jun 3 2011, 11:10 AM